tsmith417 I watched this on the Encore Western Channel. I didn't expect much going in, based on the description on the channel guide, and the film started off slow, but I found myself more interested as the film went on, and half-expected to find out it was based on a true story.I am a fan of Frederic Forest, altho in this film he is so quiet and seems almost uncomfortable that it's hard to understand how he could have played such a scary character as Blue Duck a few years later in the "Lonesome Dove" mini-series.Richard Widmark seems to be having too much fun with his role as Red, a departure from the stoic characters he played for many years, and almost seems to be saying, "I don't care what the other actors do, I'm gonna do what I want."Widmark's character is unapologetically racist, calling Thomas Black Bull "Chief" from the first time they meet, and telling him, "If it weren't for me, you'd be selling blankets." Red is all about the money, not the sport or Thomas, and scams all the locals at every rodeo Thomas rides in, only to waste all his profits on booze and women and gambling. Thomas doesn't want to go along with the scams but does because deep down he truly loves Red as a father figure. He gets frustrated and tries a couple of times to rebel but fails because his heart isn't really in it.The film gets a little choppy after Thomas Black Bull finally makes up his mind to do things his own way and abandons Red at a roadside liquor store. All of a sudden his name is Tom Black and he gets the nickname Killer because he rides the horses so hard they drop dead in the arena. Supposedly he has killed four horses this way but we only see one incident.Tom starts drinking scotch, smokes a few cigarettes, hooks up with a few women who disappear as quickly as they appear, and starts on his own downhill slide, not from the booze or women but from arrogance.When he gets thrown one too many times and realizes his arrogance isn't going to get him thru life any more he goes back to Red, who is now reaping the results of his hard-drinking, partying life. * Spoiler *Tom is finally freed when Red dies and he has nowhere to go any more, and no-one to turn to.The ending of the film is abrupt, and the only thing I really didn't like about the film, with Tom going back to the Indian school he hated as a boy, which is now being run by tribal elders instead of the White Man, and says he wants to work with horses. I found this to be slightly out of character. He had no qualms about letting horses buck themselves to death at rodeos, yet we are now to believe that his love of horses is what has been driving him all this time and the only thing he ever really wanted to do. * End Spoiler *All in all, I liked the movie. I don't know if I'd put it on my 10-best list, but the story was interesting, the characters were believable, and if nothing else, Richard Widmark's portrayal of Red is worth your time.

bkoganbing In the War Wagon, Howard Keel who plays Levi Walking Bear, derides his fellow Indians constantly saying how he's learned to live in the white man's world and beat him at his own game. When the Legends Die is a film about a contemporary Ute Indian who tries to do just that and the effect it has on him.Fredric Forrest plays Thomas Black Bull, a young Ute who we first meet as a really backward kid, no education or social skills. After he sees him riding a bucking horse, old rodeo hand Richard Widmark takes him on as a protégé and young Mr. Black Bull becomes a champion saddle bronco rider. It's a profession and skill that he is beating the white man at his own game and making some good money in the process. It offends his sense of honor though, when Widmark now asks him to lose a few contests to make the odds better when he rides for real. It's the start of a break in their relationship.Fredric Forrest has had a strange career. When the Legends Die was his third film after two bit roles, this one gave him the billing of "introducing Fredric Forrest." This was the start of a whole bunch of times when good reviews prompted critics to say that Forrest was about to break out and become a big star. It never really happened for him though. Nevertheless his stoic performance as Thomas Black Bull turning into Killer Tom Black is accomplished a lot with some very good closeups on facial expressions. They say more than dialog with a good player.Richard Widmark plays Red Dillon, the old rodeo cowboy who becomes Forrest's manager/trainer. A whole lot like the way Robert Mitchum takes on young Arthur Kennedy in The Lusty Men. But we have a far bigger cultural and generational gap than there was in The Lusty Men. Despite his good old boy upbringing, Widmark develops a real affection for Forrest so their break up is pretty painful on both sides. Widmark in his performance as Dillon shows a seamier side of rodeo than other films about the sport never have. Of course Mr. Widmark shows it with style.The film is about how Thomas Black Bull resolves all the conflicts within him. If you see the film I think you'll agree he does it in the best way any of us could.This review is dedicated to young Ryan Dirteater of the Cherokee nation in Oklahoma and fast rising star of the Professional Bull Riders. Let Ryan avoid the pitfalls that Frederic Forrest has in this film.

brice-18 I sent for a video of a film I fondly remember from more than 30 years ago, but was surprised that Widmark's role as the drunken, exploitative Red was relatively small. Forrest was never better than in his first starring role; presumably, despite his name, he is a Native American, and his riding skills cannot be wholly have been usurped by stunt riders. Anyway, he is excellent, as is the gloriously non-PC Widmark. But there are gaps in the story which I hope to fill by at long last reading the novel. I'm not sure that 'no animals were hurt in the making of this picture' - I was distressed when 'brother bear' was driven into the wilderness, and despite Tom's alleged love of horses his reputation as 'killer seems well deserved - but hey, the women hardly fare better. A film of its time, then, but well worth preserving.

whpratt1 Over the years I have always enjoyed the great acting of Richard Widmark and remember his crazy laugh while he pushed a lady in a wheel chair down a flight of stairs in a 1940's film called,"Kiss of Death",'47, which started his career. In this picture, Richard Widmark,(Red Dillon),"Madigan",'68 plays a rough and tough character from the West who lives and dies for the love of showing off his great skills with horses. Red Dillon becomes great friends with Frederic Forrest,('Killer',Tom Black Bull),"The Two Jakes",'90, who is a Native American and is a great horse lover and wins big prizes in Rodeo's through out the West. If you love this type of film, you can't miss this great Classic film and the great performance of Richard Widmark.